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  • #987774
    Craig_Longmuir
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    So, after hiring a SEO company/guy to do your SEO, who has had long term success they are really happy with??

    I hear plenty of people who getting little or no results and plenty who get short term results that drop off after 3/6/9 months (usually after sneaky SEO tactics that were being used)

    would be nice to hear some success stories and perhaps a little bit behind the workings of that success!

    #1164271
    JohnW
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    Hi Craig,
    I’ve been doing this SEO stuff for almost 20 years. (Sad, ain’t it.)

    If you adopt SEO strategies that compliment and conform with Google’s recommendations that have never varied in 14 years, SE ranking results and referrals should remain relatively constant.

    IMHO, the single biggest SEO variables are:

    1. The level of competition in a search market.
    2. The addition of new or alternative search options. Here I’m referring to G changes like searching images, searching videos, Universal search, mobile search, etc.

    The example I throw into the ring for these types of questions is the results for the G search phrase “railway sleepers Sydney”.

    The top ranked page is from a tiny 5 page website that was published 7 years ago. It has held position 1-3 for all of this time. According to many SEO consultants it breaks all the rules and has nothing going for it. (Eg. Almost no external links, no content, no social media links, etc.)

    Informed & experienced SEOs will be able to tell you why it ranks so well. Inexperieced ones will spout off a bunch of garbage about why it should be easy to out rank.

    SEO is about targeting the widest range of relevant search phrases that can be used to attract relevant traffic to a site with the least cost.

    So many SEOs will tell you, you are not ranking well for certain frequenly used search phrases. These people won’t address the essential “least cost” component of SEO.

    The most important issue however is the fact that so called “frequently used search phrases” are NOT.

    Google has never, ever quantified how people search.

    How many ways can people seach for old railway sleepers?

    This little 5 page website example has been found by people using over 11,600 different search phrases over the last 3 years. This is inspite of G no longer providing keyword info for the last 10 months.

    In a typical month (when G did provide keyword numbers) the single search phrase, “railway sleepers Sydney” only generated 800 referrals out of around 3,000 visitors. In a typical month there would be around 1,000 different search phrases that generated referrals. The next month there would be 800 unique phrases that had not been used in the previous month.

    The term “frequently used” search phrases is 200% BS. “Frequently used” means maybe 5%-10% of relevant searchers used them.

    Google is out to generate Adwords revenue. If it can focus more people on fewer keywords, they will drive up the cost per click.

    That is the Achilles heel of Adwords and it ain’t SEO.
    Regs,
    JohnW

    #1164272
    Craig_Longmuir
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    “Google is out to generate Adwords revenue. If it can focus more people on fewer keywords, they will drive up the cost per click. “

    is this also why they (increasingly) show (not provided) for most of my organic searches…meaning I have to rely more on their “frequently used search phrases”

    #1164273
    Tiggerito
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    I totally agree that one should target subjects and not keywords. Something I keep having to re-train my new clients about.

    Do the keyword research to find what sort of search terms people use. Then use that list as inspiration on how you write. Don’t just pick one keyword and spam it to death.

    And don’t hire an SEO that advertises a price per keyword.

    “Google is out to generate Adwords revenue. If it can focus more people on fewer keywords, they will drive up the cost per click. “

    The opposite is also true. If they can get advertisers to use broad match and bid on many keywords (even if they are not relevant) then the competition for those keywords increases and so does CPC.

    #1164274
    John Romaine
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    Long term SEO works so long as you commit to a long term marketing strategy.

    Too many times I see clients hitting top spot, then immediately cancelling their campaigns.

    “long term success” means long term consistency. You don’t go to the gym for 6 weeks, lose 15 kg then say “Hey, I’ve made it”, then cancel your membership and sit on the couch watching X Factor and eating pizza from there on.

    Being at the top is always temporary, unless

    a) you have no competition
    b) you’re constantly working at it

    #1164275
    Greg_M
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    Seems to me that Craig was asking for actual case studies. Something I’d really like to see also.

    With the exception of John’s contribution … zip.

    I don’t think I’ve ever seen a case study of a successful online Marketing, SEO adventure (I have looked and asked), including the costs involved.

    I appreciate it’s a field full of, if’s, but’s and maybe’s, and perhaps a $1000 per month is the base line to do it correctly … maybe I’m just thick, but to me that’s a lot of money if it’s going down the toilet.

    “trust me” (and give me money upfront) and we’ll see how long the piece of string is … doesn’t sit well in my cynical old brain.

    I accept that if I have a basically crap product or service, or a horrible site, that nothing can necessarily resurrect it.

    But, if those things are in place the rest should be quantifiable within certain margins for error.

    From the service providers side there seems to be a reluctance to provide “success stories”. I suppose this could be related to not wanting to reveal your “secrets to success”, it could also be construed that you don’t have any.

    Waiting for case studies from SEO’s has been pointless in the past. (I’ve also noticed many have shifted to rebranding themselves as marketers – apologies to those who’ve had this approach all along).

    So, I guess I’ll try another tack … are there any business owners out there that can report a successful long term campaign and an ongoing return on the spend? Bonus points for adding budgets involved.

    #1164276
    John Romaine
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    estim8, post: 190759 wrote:
    Seems to me that Craig was asking for actual case studies. Something I’d really like to see also.

    Here’s a business that I’m working with at the moment. This screenshot shows how I have increased their conversion rates (customer enquiries) up from an average of 5-7 a day to 19+ a day.

    Each of those enquiries is potentially worth $2,500.

    They’re investing $2,000 a month.

    EDIT – I know this isn’t exactly “long term” but these guys will do well, because they have a “long term” mindset with their marketing approach.

    results.gif

    #1164277
    Greg_M
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    Guess that’s a start, but it’s not what I’d call a case study, it’s only a blip on a graph over a few days.

    Amongst other things.

    I’d want know the sector, and it’s potential market size, the conversion rate of sales to enquiries, the actual nett margin off the sales and the base line you started with.

    In my industry I’d need to turn over another 240K a year minimum, to justify the expense, let alone increase profit …

    I remain a cynic :).

    Cheers

    #1164278
    John Romaine
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    estim8, post: 190808 wrote:
    Guess that’s a start, but it’s not what I’d call a case study, it’s only a blip on a graph over a few days.

    Amongst other things.

    I’d want know the sector, and it’s potential market size, the conversion rate of sales to enquiries, the actual nett margin off the sales and the base line you started with.

    In my industry I’d need to turn over another 240K a year minimum, to justify the expense, let alone increase profit …

    I remain a cynic :).

    Cheers

    1. Its a highly competitive marketplace that services government agencies, large scale corporate business and military.

    2. Conversion rates are just under 4% for this month

    3. $240k minimum? They do $250,000 a month.

    You want a long term case study?

    How does 11 years on the first page sound?

    I started this site back in 2003. Sold it around 2010. Its been on the first page of Google since I launched it. ‘garage sale’ ‘ garage sales’

    http://www.egaragesales.com.au

    By the way, that “blip” is bringing in an additional $25,000 a day.

    #1164279
    Greg_M
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    Perfect.

    That’s the stuff I wanted to see, thanks – and in the context of their turnover very good value for money.

    I’d assume given the sector, and their turnover they already had/have solid demand, customer base and brand identity, even if they had issues online.

    I guess, without trying to be a smarty … how does this fee relate to the micro, small business typical of this forum.

    My 240K crack was that you need that much additional T/O to cover the cost over the year … how many are going to go close to this as a base line even?

    If you reverse engineer your examples costs, as a proportion of their turnover its nothing … I’m sure you don’t reverse engineer your fees for a business on a smaller T/O.

    I’d still like to see something from a “small” business that came off a low base and got a successful return from a campaign.

    As for the site thats held number one – put it together with JohnW’s example and they both seem to defy gravity when I judge them against what I read here re hints on what not to do, and what works. Don’t suppose it matters a rip if they’re profitable.

    Perhaps longevity is seriously underrated.

    No wonder people get confused by all this stuff.

    #1164280
    MatthewKeath
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    John Romaine, post: 190825 wrote:
    1. Its a highly competitive marketplace that services government agencies, large scale corporate business and military.

    2. Conversion rates are just under 4% for this month

    3. $240k minimum? They do $250,000 a month.

    You want a long term case study?

    How does 11 years on the first page sound?

    I started this site back in 2003. Sold it around 2010. Its been on the first page of Google since I launched it. ‘garage sale’ ‘ garage sales’

    http://www.egaragesales.com.au

    By the way, that “blip” is bringing in an additional $25,000 a day.Man, why did you sell it? You could be typing these posts from anywhere in the world, doing what you want.

    #1164281
    John Romaine
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    estim8, post: 190827 wrote:
    I guess, without trying to be a smarty … how does this fee relate to the micro, small business typical of this forum.

    Sure. I understand.

    A lot of small businesses might not be doing those numbers, and that’s fine. For us, we prefer to work with large scale businesses that have allocated marketing budgets – not because we’re only in it for the money – but because it allows us to provide a much higher quality service offering.

    There are two types of SEO.

    SEO done right – which is labour, time, and resource intensive; and

    Cheap SEO – which involves someone in the Philippines firing up SENuke and blasting the web with keyword rich exact match anchor text all over the place.

    I always tell prospects – “Cheap SEO is always more expensive”

    Because day in day out, I’m on the phone with business owners who have invested in $99 per month SEO, who are now almost out of business because their sites have either

    a) tanked completely
    b) been penalised
    c) been deindexed

    My advice for small business owners who cannot afford to hire an agency at $1,500+ a month is to BUILD RELATIONSHIPS with others working in your market. Get involved in discussions and interact. Do videos, do podcasts, do interviews, do guest posts – get involved in outreach.

    Even if your onpage sucks, if you make the right sorts of connections with the right people in your market, the traffic will come.

    Forget about links links links links links.

    Remember – Google is only ONE WAY to get traffic. There are millions of other sites on the web. Diversify your traffic sources.

    OR

    Alternatively, shuffle around your cashflow and invest 6 months towards an online business coach, or some decent SEO.

    MatthewKeath, post: 190829 wrote:
    Man, why did you sell it? You could be typing these posts from anywhere in the world, doing what you want.

    I sold that site because I got into a tight spot with a property development gig I got into. I needed the cash at the time to finish the project.

    The new owner unfortunately, has ruined that site. :(

    #1164282
    Cesar
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    In case you are not aware, there was another major Panda Update that was rolled out in the last two days. The results for myself have been great, mainly because I have been focusing on building my Brand Name through different online mediums, and forgetting totally about “links” and “ranking.”

    Everyone should be focusing on how to attract customers, how to best service them and offer “Quality” from all aspects of your business. Remember most importantly, “Do everything with a Smile and Honestly” and your customers will “Love You.”

    #1164283
    Stuart B
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    Long term success in this area is more about common sense, but sadly it isn’t common practice.

    I like to think about SEO kind of like a financial investment portfolio. You would be foolish to only invest in one kind of area because if the market shifts you stand to lose a lot.
    Similarly with SEO / content marketing you would want to be actively working in a variety of areas, and doing so in a manner that’s in line with Google’s guidelines and philosophies.

    What others have said is right. Many people want to throw money grenades at the problem, get to the top and then walk away. What you really want to be doing is producing great quality sharable content, and continuing to do so long after you get where you want to be.

    #1164284
    John Romaine
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    Octopus Labs, post: 190862 wrote:
    You would be foolish to only invest in one kind of area.

    Exactly right.

    Business owners have been doing this forever. However they seem to lose idea of the concept when it comes to the online space.

    Here are some illustrations that I did up to demonstrate how business owners are using a variety of sources to get customers through their doors right now, and how this same principle applies in the online space.

    OFFLINE (traditional business marketing, or what many of you are doing right now)

    offline-marketing.gif.png

    ONLINE

    online-marketing.gif.png

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